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after another to the commission of crime； Socrates let fall an
observation： 〃It would be sufficiently extraordinary if the keeper of
a herd of cattle＇20＇ who was continually thinning and impoverishing
his cattle did not admit himself to be a sorry sort of herdsman； but
that a ruler of the state who was continually thinning and
impoverishing the citizens should neither be ashamed nor admit himself
to be a sorry sort of ruler was more extraordinary still。〃 The remark
being reported to the government； Socrates was summoned by Critias and
Charicles； who proceeded to point out the law and forbade him to
converse with the young。 〃Was it open to him；〃 Socrates inquired of
the speaker； 〃in case he failed to understand their commands in any
point； to ask for an explanation？〃
＇17＇ Lit。 〃Nomothetes。〃 See 〃Hell。〃 II。 iii。 2； Dem。 706。 For
Charicles see Lys。 〃c。 Eratosth。〃 S。 56； Aristot。 〃Pol。〃 v。 6。 6。
＇18＇ See Diog。 Laert。 II。 v。 （〃Socr。〃）
＇19＇ i。e。 ｛to ton etto logon kreitto poiein｝； 〃of making the worse
appear the better cause。〃 Cf。 Arist。 〃Clouds。〃
＇20＇ See Dio Chrys。 〃Or。〃 43。
〃Certainly；〃 the two assented。
Then Socrates： I am prepared to obey the laws； but to avoid
transgression of the law through ignorance I need instruction： is it
on the supposition that the art of words tends to correctness of
statement or to incorrectness that you bid us abstain from it？ for if
the former； it is clear we must abstain from speeking correctly； but
if the latter； our endeavour should be to amend our speech。
To which Charicles； in a fit of temper； retorted： In consideration of
your ignorance；＇21＇ Socrates； we will frame the prohibition in
language better suited to your intelligence： we forbid you to hold any
conversation whatsoever with the young。
＇21＇ See Aristot。 〃de Soph。 El。〃 183 b7。
Then Socrates： To avoid all ambiguity then； or the possibility of my
doing anything else than what you are pleased to command； may I ask
you to define up to what age a human being is to be considered young？
For just so long a time （Charicles answered） as he is debarred from
sitting as a member of the Council；＇22＇ as not having attained to the
maturity of wisdom； accordingly you will not hold converse with any
one under the age of thirty。
＇22＇ The Boule or Senate。 See W。 L。 Newman； 〃Pol。 Aristot。〃 i。 326。
Soc。 In making a purchase even； I am not to ask； what is the price of
this？ if the vendor is under the age of thirty？
Cha。 Tut； things of that sort： but you know； Socrates； that you have a
way of asking questions； when all the while you know how the matter
stands。 Let us have no questions of that sort。
Soc。 Nor answers either； I suppose； if the inquiry concerns what I
know； as； for instance； where does Charicles live？ or where is Critias
to be found？
Oh yes； of course； things of that kind （replied Charicles）； while
Critias added： But at the same time you had better have done with your
shoemakers； carpenters； and coppersmiths。＇23＇ These must be pretty
well trodden out at heel by this time； considering the circulation you
have given them。
＇23＇ Cf。 Plat。 〃Gorg。〃 491 A； 〃Symp。〃 221 E； Dio Chrys。 〃Or。〃 55； 560
D； 564 A。
Soc。 And am I to hold away from their attendant topics alsothe just；
the holy； and the like？
Most assuredly （answered Charicles）； and from cowherds in particular；
or else see that you do not lessen the number of the herd yourself。
Thus the secret was out。 The remark of Socrates about the cattle had
come to their ears； and they could not forgive the author of it。
Perhaps enough has been said to explain the kind of intimacy which had
subsisted between Critias and Socrates； and their relation to one
another。 But I will venture to maintain that where the teacher is not
pleasing to the pupil there is no education。 Now it cannot be said of
Critias and Alcibiades that they associated with Socrates because they
found him pleasing to them。 And this is true of the whole period。 From
the first their eyes were fixed on the headship of the state as their
final goal。 During the time of their imtimacy with Socrates there were
no disputants whom they were more eager to encounter than professed
politicians。
Thus the story is told of Alcibiadeshow before the age of twenty he
engaged his own guardian； Pericles； at that time prime minister of the
state； in a discussion concerning laws。
Alc。 Please； Pericles； can you teach me what a law is？
Per。 To be sure I can。
Alc。 I should be so much obliged if you would do so。 One so often
hears the epithet 〃law…abiding〃 applied in a complimentary sense； yet；
it strikes me； one hardly deserves the compliment； if one does not
know what a law is。
Per。 Fortunately there is a ready answer to your difficulty。 You wish
to know what a law is？ Well； those are laws which the majority； being
met together in conclave； approve and enact as to what it is right to
do； and what it is right to abstain from doing。
Alc。 Enact on the hypothesis that it is right to do what is good？ or
to do what is bad？
Per。 What is good； to be sure； young sir； not what is bad。
Alc。 Supposing it is not the majority； but； as in the case of an
oligarchy； the minority； who meet and enact the rules of conduct； what
are these？
Per。 Whatever the ruling power of the state after deliberation enacts
as our duty to do； goes by the name of laws。
Alc。 Then if a tyrant； holding the chief power in the state； enacts
rules of conduct for the citizens； are these enactments law？
Per。 Yes； anything which a tyrant as head of the state enacts； also
goes by the name of law。
Alc。 But； Pericles； violence and lawlessnesshow do we define them？
Is it not when a stronger man forces a weaker to do what seems right
to himnot by persuasion but by compulsion？
Per。 I should say so。
Alc。 It would seem to follow that if a tyrant； without persuading the
citizens； drives them by enactment to do certain thingsthat is
lawlessness？
Per。 You are right； and I retract the statement that measures passed
by a tyrant without persuasion of the citizens are law。
Alc。 And what of measures passed by a minority； not by persuasion of
the majority； but in the exercise of its power only？ Are we； or are we
not； to apply the term violence to these？
Per。 I think that anything which any one forces another to do without
persuasion； whether by enactment or not； is violence rather than law。
Alc。 It would seem that everything which the majority； in the exercise
of its power over the possessors of wealth； and without persuading
them； chooses to enact； is of the nature of violence rather than of
law？
To be sure （answered Pericles）； adding： At your age we were clever
hands at such quibbles ourselves。 It was just such subtleties which we
used to practise our wits upon； as you do now； if I mistake not。
To which Alcibiades replied： Ah； Pericles； I do wish we could have met
in those days when you were at your cleverest in such matters。
Well； then； as soon as the desired superiority over the politicians of
the day seemed to be attained； Critias and Alcibiades turned their
backs on Socrates。 They found his society unattractive； not to sp